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	<title>Comments on: The Great Web Debate: Ads!</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.joemanna.com/blog/the-great-web-debate-ads/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.joemanna.com/blog/the-great-web-debate-ads/</link>
	<description>Tech News, Social Media &#38; Politics From a Geek</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 16:53:40 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Junkyard Willie</title>
		<link>http://www.joemanna.com/blog/the-great-web-debate-ads/#comment-22200</link>
		<dc:creator>Junkyard Willie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Sep 2007 07:18:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.joemanna.com/blog/the-great-web-debate-ads/#comment-22200</guid>
		<description>Those points against AdBlock are pretty weak.  First of all, "violating copyright by infringing on a Web page?"  Are you f---ing serious?  This is the same argument the broadcast industry tried to use in their lawsuits attempting to prevent the spread of VCR's and DVR's (due to the ability of viewers to skip or fast-forward through commercials).  It was nonsense then and it's laughable now.  The anti AdBlock website even quotes one of these court case (WGN v. United Video  (1982)); although I think it's admirable they were able to find one of the few cases where the judge didn't simply throw it out accompanied by much wailing and gnashing of teeth on the part of the broadcasters.  

You made a great point on even casual users becoming blind to the ads anyway- you probably drove past 20 billboards on the way to work.  That's 200 views a week assuming the same saturation both ways, plus you're always seeing the same 40 ads; and I'll give you a dollar if you can remember more than 5 of them of the top of your head.  Hell, I'll give you a cookie if you can remember 2.  How's that for a "micropayment"?

It's worth repeating that the kind of person who would use ABP in the first place is the type not to pay attention to the ads in the first place and certainly not the type to click them... when has your average "savvy user" ever clicked on the big flashing FREE IPOD banner?  If some sites become "extinct" due to 2% of users blocking ads, well, I guess that's like Darwin for the Internet or something.

If these folks really want to make the big bucks from their blog posts or whatever, make it a paid subscription.  Oh what's that?  Nobody would pay to read this stuff?  Well, maybe that says something about its value, but then I'm no more a literature critic than these guys are professional writers.  I like your idea for "content providers" (ugh I hate that weasel phrase) to offer no-ads if you pay a fee- I'd love to see it blow up in their face as users turned elsewhere for content and downloaded ABP along the way.  

Imagine a TV network that says "to continue bringing you this programming and to maintain our profit margin, we've implemented new technology that will prevent you from skipping commercials with a DVR or videotape!  Thanks for your support!"  How many people will watch that channel?  Will people that don't even own a VCR or DVR hear about the ruckus?  How will they react?  

By fighting this unwinnable fight, the anti-ABP guys are giving the pro-ABP'ers more free publicity than they could possibly have hoped for.  I guess they could just make ABP illegal and sue anyone who tried to read their site without looking at ads- that's what the RIAA does and they've pretty much shut down all that music downloading...

The notion that someone automatically blocking an ad they aren't going to pay attention to anyway and certainly won't click amounts to stealing money is so awesome I can't belive I hadn't thought of it before.  Only when I say "awesome" I mean "retarded."  Potential revenue != revenue.  I sure hope the people blocking Firefox aren't channel-surfing or hitting Mute during commercials or using a TiVo to fast-forward through them as they watch TV; because then they too would become copyright-infringing theives.  Other "guerilla tactics" I hope they aren't doing include:

-Looking away from the screen (perhaps to talk to a friend or loved one) during the commercials that play before a movie in the theater- or worse, entering the theater after the ads have started, missing some or all of them entirely.

-Changing radio stations or lowering the volume during commerical breaks, or conversing with others, preventing them from fully focusing on the advertisement.

-Skipping previews and ads on DVDs.

-Throwing away junk mail (oops, I meant "direct-mail targeted marketing material") before reading it.

-Tearing ads and subscription cards out of magazines.

-Failing to Click Here for a Free Trial.

Do we really need *more* advertising?  Is that what's going to make the Internet a better place?

Finally, it's my computer, I'll control which data is processed or displayed on it, thanks.  To those who would surrender that control to companies trying to profit off of them, I say "have fun with that."  I'll keep my ABP.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Those points against AdBlock are pretty weak.  First of all, &#8220;violating copyright by infringing on a Web page?&#8221;  Are you f&#8212;ing serious?  This is the same argument the broadcast industry tried to use in their lawsuits attempting to prevent the spread of VCR&#8217;s and DVR&#8217;s (due to the ability of viewers to skip or fast-forward through commercials).  It was nonsense then and it&#8217;s laughable now.  The anti AdBlock website even quotes one of these court case (WGN v. United Video  (1982)); although I think it&#8217;s admirable they were able to find one of the few cases where the judge didn&#8217;t simply throw it out accompanied by much wailing and gnashing of teeth on the part of the broadcasters.  </p>
<p>You made a great point on even casual users becoming blind to the ads anyway- you probably drove past 20 billboards on the way to work.  That&#8217;s 200 views a week assuming the same saturation both ways, plus you&#8217;re always seeing the same 40 ads; and I&#8217;ll give you a dollar if you can remember more than 5 of them of the top of your head.  Hell, I&#8217;ll give you a cookie if you can remember 2.  How&#8217;s that for a &#8220;micropayment&#8221;?</p>
<p>It&#8217;s worth repeating that the kind of person who would use ABP in the first place is the type not to pay attention to the ads in the first place and certainly not the type to click them&#8230; when has your average &#8220;savvy user&#8221; ever clicked on the big flashing FREE IPOD banner?  If some sites become &#8220;extinct&#8221; due to 2% of users blocking ads, well, I guess that&#8217;s like Darwin for the Internet or something.</p>
<p>If these folks really want to make the big bucks from their blog posts or whatever, make it a paid subscription.  Oh what&#8217;s that?  Nobody would pay to read this stuff?  Well, maybe that says something about its value, but then I&#8217;m no more a literature critic than these guys are professional writers.  I like your idea for &#8220;content providers&#8221; (ugh I hate that weasel phrase) to offer no-ads if you pay a fee- I&#8217;d love to see it blow up in their face as users turned elsewhere for content and downloaded ABP along the way.  </p>
<p>Imagine a TV network that says &#8220;to continue bringing you this programming and to maintain our profit margin, we&#8217;ve implemented new technology that will prevent you from skipping commercials with a DVR or videotape!  Thanks for your support!&#8221;  How many people will watch that channel?  Will people that don&#8217;t even own a VCR or DVR hear about the ruckus?  How will they react?  </p>
<p>By fighting this unwinnable fight, the anti-ABP guys are giving the pro-ABP&#8217;ers more free publicity than they could possibly have hoped for.  I guess they could just make ABP illegal and sue anyone who tried to read their site without looking at ads- that&#8217;s what the RIAA does and they&#8217;ve pretty much shut down all that music downloading&#8230;</p>
<p>The notion that someone automatically blocking an ad they aren&#8217;t going to pay attention to anyway and certainly won&#8217;t click amounts to stealing money is so awesome I can&#8217;t belive I hadn&#8217;t thought of it before.  Only when I say &#8220;awesome&#8221; I mean &#8220;retarded.&#8221;  Potential revenue != revenue.  I sure hope the people blocking Firefox aren&#8217;t channel-surfing or hitting Mute during commercials or using a TiVo to fast-forward through them as they watch TV; because then they too would become copyright-infringing theives.  Other &#8220;guerilla tactics&#8221; I hope they aren&#8217;t doing include:</p>
<p>-Looking away from the screen (perhaps to talk to a friend or loved one) during the commercials that play before a movie in the theater- or worse, entering the theater after the ads have started, missing some or all of them entirely.</p>
<p>-Changing radio stations or lowering the volume during commerical breaks, or conversing with others, preventing them from fully focusing on the advertisement.</p>
<p>-Skipping previews and ads on DVDs.</p>
<p>-Throwing away junk mail (oops, I meant &#8220;direct-mail targeted marketing material&#8221;) before reading it.</p>
<p>-Tearing ads and subscription cards out of magazines.</p>
<p>-Failing to Click Here for a Free Trial.</p>
<p>Do we really need *more* advertising?  Is that what&#8217;s going to make the Internet a better place?</p>
<p>Finally, it&#8217;s my computer, I&#8217;ll control which data is processed or displayed on it, thanks.  To those who would surrender that control to companies trying to profit off of them, I say &#8220;have fun with that.&#8221;  I&#8217;ll keep my ABP.</p>
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